Do relationships need physical boundaries? Feat. Tierna Gill

We live in a world in which the majority of people will get into a relationship! Pair that relationship with our desires, urges and sinful self? Problems arise and so boundaries become a necessity.

In this podcast we look at why we need boundaries? We look how boundaries are communicated? We we look at how purity is a heart posture? We address the shame that surrounds this topic and the specifics of what can be done and what can't be done, as well as what can be yes for some, but no for others.

Look out for a follow up blog on this topic!

Time Codes:

0:00 - Intro
2:28 - What does the Bible say about this?
3:26 - What is the prescriptive commands?
7:33 - What is descriptive?
9:09 - Why do you need boundaries?
11:51 - How do we communicate the boundaries?
14:27 - Purity is a heart posture?
17:18 - How close can we get to the line?
18:49 - What do we do with the shame that surrounds this topic?
21:47 - What is sexual immorality?
23:48 - Conscience and the specifics 
25:02 - Conscience framework
26:23 - Accountability framework
28:36 - Summary
32:31 - What a relationship is and isn't
33:04 - Peace over passion
33:38 - What I can and can't do in a relationship?
35:13 - The nature of the kiss matters
38:05 - Entering the bomb zone
38:41 - My parents could see me doing this
40:13 - We are sinners and this is a conversation
41:14 - Conscience blog

Music by
Over the limits
Vernacolmusic

Chapters

• 0:00 Intro
• 2:28 What does the Bible say about this?
• 3:26 What is the prescriptive commands?
• 7:33 What is descriptive?What does the Bible say about this?
• 9:09 Why do you need boundaries?
• 11:51 How do we communicate the boundaries?
• 14:27 Purity is a heart posture
• 17:18 How close can we get to the line?
• 18:49 What do we do with the shame that surrounds this topic?
• 21:47 What is sexual immorality?
• 23:48 Conscience and the specifics
• 25:02 Conscience framework
• 26:23 Accountability framework
• 28:36 Summary
• 32:31 What a relationship is and isn't
• 33:04 Peace over passion
• 33:38 What I can and can't do in a relationship?
• 35:13 The nature of the kiss matters
• 38:05 Entering the bomb zone
• 38:41 My parents could see me doing this
• 40:13 We are sinners and this is a conversation
• 41:14 Conscience blog

Transcript

Wildfire podcast is an extension of Wildfire, which has a focus of igniting men and women of God into a deeper discipleship with Christ, instilling people with a passion to radically and relentlessly pursue Christ wherever that leads.

That God's truth will spread like a wildfire.

Welcome back to another podcast, everybody.

Welcome.

I am joined with Tierna Gill.

Who the heck are you and how did you get here?

Yeah, I'm Tierna.

I'm from Valimena, which is probably the most interesting thing about me.

Yeah.

I love the Lord.

I'm very passionate about his word and about how we can use that and like spray each other on and stuff.

I got here.

How did I get here?

I was just asked.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I was like, sure.

Yeah.

I don't know what I've been cleared, but here we are.

So yeah, love the Lord.

That's great.

Basically.

First of all, we have to revise that.

So next time someone asks you, who are you?

The first fact that you get is not that you're from Valimena.

Yeah.

Because you're more interesting than that.

There's more to you than Valimena.

But I think that's sort of the thing with Valimena people.

I think they're just proud from where they come from.

Yeah.

I think we think it's the center of the universe.

It's just that the nationalistic identity of Valimena.

And in that regard, yes, we respect that.

So the podcast that we're actually talking about today is, Do relationships need boundaries?

Yes.

Thanks guys for listening.

And we'll see you next time.

So do relationships need boundaries?

We're going to explore that a bit because the reality is, you know what I mean, the majority of the population will get in a relationship.

There's only a select few who are called to the blessedness of celibacy.

The camera caught that as well, okay?

The podcast listeners didn't see that.

But if you want to see what happens, go watch the footage on YouTube.

So celibacy is a gift given by God and that's given to a select few.

It's not the majority, it's the minority.

So we're speaking into a situation that affects, you know what I mean, about 90% of the population, okay?

That's not a direct statistic, but I'm just throwing it out there anyway.

Don't go in there.

So let's just get in to this podcast, dive straight in.

First of all, I want to say that whenever we come to anything in the Bible, we have to ask ourselves anything in life, sorry, we have to ask ourselves, what does the Bible say about this?

So whenever people come up to you and ask you, what do you think about drinking?

What do you think about smoking?

What do you think about abortion?

What do you think about homosexuality?

What do you think about racism?

What do you think about taking this drink of water?

What do you think about anything?

What does the Bible have to say about what you do and why you do it?

We're not the authority like the Lord is, so.

Exactly.

God is the authority.

And you then say, OK, but the Bible.

So Jesus is our authority and Jesus rose from the dead.

And that's the foundation of Christianity.

And Jesus is the word.

So the word is that which has been spoken by God.

And so we first start with Jesus, and then from Jesus, we get the word.

And the word is the Bible and its totality.

And so that's why in any given topic, such as this one, to relationships and boundaries, we go to the Bible.

What does the Bible say about it?

And there is much, is there, does the Bible speak to this?

Yes.

It does.

It does speak to it.

OK, so number one, that which is prescriptive.

So if someone said to you, look, what do you think of murder?

I'm going to go to the Bible, because it is the authority and not me.

And it says, I shall not murder.

That is what is called a prescriptive command.

There are those commands that are just explicit in the Bible that tell us what not to do and what to do.

And of course, those regulations are given by our God, our Father to help us.

And we should respond in love.

They were given out of love and we should respond in love obedience.

If you love me, you will obey my commands.

And so what does the Bible have to say prescriptively about this?

And it may seem that I'm speaking, the majority, at the start here, but Tierna, she will speak the longest in this podcast, I assure you.

Okay, she is going to be the person that we question.

Okay, so versus, prescriptive verses in the Bible about what we should do and what we shouldn't do.

Say this, 1 Corinthians 6, 18, flee from sexual morality.

Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but this is actually a moral person, sins against his own body.

There is this category in the Bible called sexual morality, and it is clearly put in a category of its own, like many other sins, because every other sin commits outside the body, but this, this is done within the body.

So there's clearly, we can't go into the depths of what that means, but it is just to say that sexual sin is something very different and affects us very differently.

He was 13, 4 says, let marriage be held in honor among all, and let the marriage bed be on defiled, for God will judge the sexual, sexually immoral and adulterous.

First Thessalonians 4, 3, 5.

Do you want to know what the will of God for your life is, Tierna?

What is the will of God for my life?

Get ready.

For this is the will of God for your life, your sanctification, that you abstain from sexual morality, that each one of you know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, not in the passion of lust, like the Gentiles who do not know God.

Matthew 5, 28 says, but I said to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

So the reality is, I sitting right now, I have committed adultery because I've lusted.

Have you committed adultery?

Yes.

Because you've lusted?

We all feel three sinners.

Period, yeah.

Period.

Every single one of us.

Ephesians 5, 3 says, but sexual immorality and all impurity or coveness must not even be named among you, as is proper among the saints.

And it goes on and on and on and on.

There are many verses that speak to sexual immorality.

And whenever we talk by first Sessomians, it talks about, what is the will of God for your life?

What is the will of God for my life?

It specifically homes in on that.

You abstain from sexual immorality, that you control your body.

Not like the cultural around us, that's key.

We're called not to conform as Christians.

And so whatever the culture says is right, as the sexual standard, we don't go from the sexual standard because the Bible tells us not to conform to that standard.

And it specifically says that you're not to control your body and the passions of the lust, like those around you.

Instead, conform to the will of God, which is sanctification, abstaining from sexual immorality.

So prescriptively, the Bible is clear about this idea of sexual immorality.

And we're going to, that is the prescriptive sin.

Sexual immorality is a sin.

And it talks about keeping the marriage bed on defiled.

So you're saying, what are you saying?

I can't hold hands, I can't hug.

That's physical.

And we're going to talk specifically into that area.

As a principle, anything that is physical outside the covenant and marriage is more than likely going to be sexual immorality.

And as it has with us a specific nature and a specific desire that hugging someone, that kissing someone, a certain type of kiss, and hugging, they don't fall, hand holding, they don't fall into that category of what we're talking about, the physical things that pertain to sexual immorality.

But we're going to talk a little bit more specifically about that.

I'm still going to keep talking, so just be quiet.

The second thing that you want to go to in the Bible is, okay, what does the Bible say?

Prescriptively, specific commands, which we've looked at.

What does the Bible say?

Descriptively.

So what are the stories in the Bible that highlight sexual immorality, and what are the consequences of those people who commit sexual immorality?

And we read of nearly every Bible character commits sexual immorality, because it has a specific hold on humanity.

So you've got the likes of Abraham sleeping with Hagar.

Abraham's already married, so there you go.

We also read of sexual immorality taking place in Sodom and Gomorrah.

We read of Lot straight after being saved from the sexual immorality of Sodom and Gomorrah and the punishment that God enacts.

He then goes and sleeps with his daughters.

So what's going on?

And we also read about how he presented his daughters to be raped.

What?

A lot good on there.

Yeah.

And we also read of David and Bathsheba.

We also read of Solomon having over like 700 concubines.

There's just a lot of adultery going on.

A lot of sexual immorality.

And we also read of in the church, sexual immorality taking place in the church in Corinth.

Paul says that even pagans don't even do what you're doing.

That's how bad it is.

So sexual sin has a specific hold, and we can look prescriptively and descriptively to see that sexual immorality is not a good thing.

And God has specifically said that we should not commit sexual immorality.

That is the prescriptive command.

In any descriptive case that we have, it goes horribly wrong for that person.

There is punishment.

There is consequence.

Why do we need boundaries?

Okay, this is my turn.

Yeah, so why do we need boundaries?

And what is the function of boundaries?

So first of all, God created sex.

He designed it.

It's divinely constructed.

And it's so, so beautiful.

And it's such a gift from God.

This means that it holds power.

If used incorrectly or in the wrong settings, sex can be very dangerous.

For example, fire.

So if used correctly, in the little fire pot, what's that called?

Like a stone?

Fascinating.

A fire pot.

If in the fire pot, it's protected and it can be used in a good way.

But if not, it can burn.

It can put everything on flame.

So yeah, so it holds immense power.

When dating, the enemy will try to tempt you to sex.

And when married, the enemy will try to keep you from sex.

So the enemy sees the power of sex, and we need to as well.

So boundaries are a source of protection.

Proverbs 4.23 says, guard your heart above all else for it determines the course of your life.

Boundaries help us prioritize the father's ways above ours.

And boundaries are barriers that come between us and the temptation to pursue things that separate us from God.

They make us spiritually healthier and they point us to Jesus.

As well, discipline is extremely painful when it happens sometimes, but it's incredibly necessary.

Discipline helps us to grow more in God's likeness.

Hebrews 12 verses 5 to 8 says, don't make light of the Lord's discipline and don't give up when he corrects you.

For the Lord disciplines those he loves and he punishes each one he accepts as his child.

1st Corinthians 6, 18 to 20 says, you must honor God with your body.

That's just the end part.

So we don't own our bodies.

These are not our own.

Everything we do with our bodies and everything we think should glorify the father.

That's how we're on the earth.

That's our purpose in everything we do in life.

As well, we are called to be set apart from the world.

Our lives and how we date should not make sense to a non-Christian.

Our society is so, so obsessed with sex, but we are called to respect it.

1st Peter 1.16 says you must be holy because I am holy.

So can the world say that you're different in how you date?

I think that's it.

Well, so, that's why we need boundaries.

So we've looked at, okay, here's the topic, like any topic.

What does the Bible say?

Prescriptively, descriptively.

Why do we need boundaries?

Tierna's just highlighted.

So the second question that I want to ask you is, how do I communicate the boundaries?

Is that the question I should ask you?

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah.

So I think some people maybe view, like, the boundaries conversation in a little bit.

Yeah, she's quoting, she's quoting.

If you're listening, she's doing the bunny rabbits.

Yeah, as like a bad thing and a scary thing and something that's awkward.

But boundaries and those conversations create such an intentional depth within your relationship.

Our relationship is not self-serving.

You need to know your partner's boundaries and respect them.

You can't expect your boundaries to be respected if you haven't communicated them first.

So something I say to everyone, and everyone will know that I say this all the time, but you can't expect what you don't express.

So that open communication is so, so vital.

The difficult and awkward conversations are usually the ones that need to happen within your relationship, and they help to set up healthy expectations.

So I definitely think that having a conversation early about your boundaries is very important.

So form the pattern of honest and open communication from the beginning, and then it'll be easier for you to, like, often talk about it.

And have regular check-ins.

I think that's very, very important.

Boundaries will change throughout your relationship, and that's okay, but you have to communicate about this.

So I've got here for relationships to work, it takes work, and that sounds like such a little cringy Pinterest quote.

But it's so, so true.

You need to ask each other those difficult questions, and you need to have respect for one another and patience with one another.

As well, you're not married, so don't act like it.

Delayed gratification is a good thing, and self-control is a fruit of the spirit.

We are called to deny ourselves.

Spiritual boundaries are also important.

I agree with that, yes.

Another podcast coming your way.

Yeah, so I think sometimes we focus too much on just physical boundaries, but also looking at spiritual and emotional boundaries.

In a relationship, like I am not your main provision of spiritual intimacy, Jesus is.

There is a significant difference between a first-hand relationship with Jesus and the second-hand one.

So don't be spiritually dependent on each other.

I just threw that in there.

So yeah, just talk about things, communicate things from the beginning, communicate them regularly.

And yeah, the awkward conversations need to happen.

Yeah.

So good.

So good.

Purity is a hard posture.

What do you say to that?

A statement, a question.

Purity is a hard posture?

Question mark.

Tierna, give me the answer.

So yeah, I think sometimes we focus so much on the do's and the don'ts.

I've had so many people ask me, they're like, how close are we to the line, also in Bunny Rabbits?

I think if this is a question that you're asking yourself, then this might be the wrong question.

I heard an analogy once about a car.

So if you're driving on the road and there's like the white line in the middle of the road, you don't even want to go near that line because you know if you go over that line, then you might hit a bike or you might hit a person or you might hit a car with a family.

So you stay within your line because you want to protect yourself and because you want to protect others.

So I think that can be applied as well.

I think good questions to ask yourself is, why am I doing this?

Is it out of affection or is it out of sexual pleasure?

What am I thinking about?

And is this gore fine God?

2 Timothy chapter 2 verses 22 says, run from anything that stimulates your full lusts.

So do dance on bunny rabbits, the line, flee from it, run from it.

You have to honor, protect and respect one another.

Whoever you're in a relationship with, they are a son or a daughter of the king, and you have to treat them like that and view them like that.

I think a big thing in purity is listening to your convictions.

So be very intentional and prayerful about them.

But the main thing is conviction leads to behavioural change.

Sam 2515 says, my eyes are always on the Lord, for he rescues me from the traps of my enemies.

So within your relationship, you need to keep your eyes on the Lord.

He is your priority.

And if you open up your heart to conviction, then he will.

As well, be open to correction from others.

We often look to others to be validated and not corrected, but there's so many verses about accountability or about wise counsel in the Bible.

Proverbs 19, 20 says, get all the advice and instruction you can, so you will be wise the rest of your life.

And Proverbs 20, 18 says, don't go to war without wise advice.

So have accountability.

This is so important and so, so vital.

Share your boundaries with your close friends and mentors, and they can help keep you accountable.

Romans 12, 3 says, don't think you're better than you really are.

So be open to correction.

Nobody is perfect.

And James 5, 16 says, confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed.

One of the most significant ways we can fight for purity is to be open with one another.

Mm, so good.

I have also heard an analogy.

Would you like to share your analogy?

I'm going to.

This idea about getting close to the line, as you said, how close can we get?

That's the wrong question.

It shows that you're in the wrong frame of mind.

And if you think of sex, we've referred to it in your analogy, we've also referred to it as fire that can get out of control and needs to be put in the correct confines, the correct safeguards, the correct parameters, which is the covenanted marge, there and there only is it safe.

And I think it's this idea of a bomb, if you think of sex as a bomb.

And this bomb is about to go off, and you don't think to yourself, how close can I get to the bomb before it goes off?

That's ludicrous.

But instead, you think to yourself, how far can I get away from the bomb?

And that's the mentality that we should have whenever you're in a relationship, not how close can I get to that line, rather what is the safe and biblical place where I can stand, where I'm safe.

Because if you think it's like a car on a hill, and it's about to go down, and you put that handbrake down, that's the way lust works.

So lust is the car.

And when you put the handbrake down, inevitably, it will just go one way.

And so you need to make sure that your car has the handbrake up and is sitting on the other side of the hill.

Upward, you want to make sure that you're not going to go downward into any sin that God does not want you to be in.

So what then do you do with the shame that surrounds this topic?

Because people sitting here right now may feel convicted.

They themselves have committed sexual immorality.

They have not done what God has appointed, what God has commanded.

They have not done the best of what God has called them to be.

God wants to protect his children.

And people have firsthand seen what has happened when they break those commandments and how committing new sexual acts just hurts them directly and it hurts the people that are around them.

And that in no way is it a good thing.

And they feel a lot of guilt and a lot of shame.

And they feel like there's no real way forward.

It's like, yes, I knew that which is sexual immorality, and I've done it.

So now what?

Yeah, I think the main thing that I probably say to those who are listening and who feel like that is, you're not your past.

If you have brought that baggage, if you've brought that weight to the father, if you've repented of that, then you're forgiven.

Is your, are we gonna say something there?

Sorry, I was sinking into myself there.

Sorry, keep going.

So yeah, you're completely forgiven.

You're white as snow, you're wash clean.

So you also need, through the father's strength, to forgive yourself and also to forgive whoever has hurt you.

You're not perfect, and in a relationship, you're also, you're in a relationship with someone who also isn't perfect.

And so things will happen, fights will happen, et cetera, et cetera.

So the most important thing to do in that situation is to communicate, to turn to the father, forgive yourselves, forgive each other, and allow the father to forgive you.

As well, it's never too late to turn from what you're doing.

So I think sometimes if we've crossed the line in many years again, then we maybe feel like we can't come back from that.

And if I've already done it once, then why can't I just do it again?

If I've already fallen short once, then why can't I just keep on doing that?

But that is not the mindset, that's not the heart posture that we should have.

The father is always there with open arms, so run to that, run to him for forgiveness.

He will always be there for you.

Okay, yeah?

All my little pictures.

Brilliant, and I think that was the key there.

It's this idea of with repentance, there comes a practical change.

So God doesn't forgive you just so you can relapse and then go and commit the same sins.

Rather, God's forgiveness liberates us, sets us free from the captivity and bondage of sin, and that we don't use our liberty, as the Bible talks about, to go and keep on sinning.

No, rather there's this change in direction and we want to be obedient.

So coming to the close of this podcast, I actually want to highlight some safeguards.

So number one is what does the Bible say about this topic, if it has anything to say on boundaries?

And we've talked about how sexual morality is the selling off of sexual purity and involves any type of sexual expression outside the boundaries of a biblically defined marriage relationship.

So anything physical that takes place outside a covenanted marriage that God has not permitted, that is what is classified as sexual morality.

Specifics, anything that is going to cause you to lust, because if you look at a woman with lust, then you committed adultery.

So you need to think about, is the thing that I'm doing, is me holding hands, is me hugging, is me kissing, causing me to lust, causing that person to lust.

That's a specific aspect of what God has said we shouldn't do.

And if we do it, then we're clearly breaking the command of sexual immorality.

It also, you know, I mean, your specifics include pedophilia, other forms of sexual morality that we could go into.

There are specifics that talk about what sexual immorality is.

So then the next thing that we want to do is actually ask ourselves about the specifics.

Because people then say, okay, can I hold hands?

Can I hug?

Can I kiss?

And so we think that the explicites and the big new news are going to be this idea of having sex outside of marriage.

They're going to, as we said, anything that is going to cause you to lust, don't do it, because then you're committing the sin of sexual immorality, which God says is wrong.

Anything that is going to sell off sexual purity.

Don't do that.

And so it then comes down to the specifics.

It becomes a conscience issue.

The sexual immorality is the prescriptive command, this idea of anything that's going to cause you lust.

That applies to anyone.

But then whenever you apply it to your own relationship, you need to...

There's so much loud music going on in the background, but people won't be able to hear that.

But we're being serenaded right now.

So now in this category of the conscience that speaks into the specifics, because the Bible has nothing to say specifically about holding hands or about certain types of kisses, because there's holy kisses in the Bible, so specific types of kisses or specific hugging.

And so in these things, it comes down to the conscience.

And Romans talks about the conscience, about this idea of defiling the conscience.

God has instilled a morality within us, and that morality is heightened, and is perfected whenever we enter a relationship with God, because we now have the spirit, so we have this conviction, the power, and the motivation to identify and not engage in sin.

And so you need to apply your own conscience to the relationship whenever you use or establish in boundaries, which is what we talked about.

So establish the absolutes, anything that's going to cause us to lust, any physical intimacy outside the covenant marriage, it's going to sell purity, such as sex outside of marriage, or anything that's going to defile our conscience.

They're the things that we need to avoid.

And so the framework that you can use to decide, is this going against my conscience or not, is called what I call the conscience framework.

So you have to ask yourself, is what we're doing, what is the act?

So what actually are we doing?

Number two is character.

What's my character showcasing in this moment and what we're doing?

What is it showcasing in that person?

What are the implications and effects of what you are doing?

What use are thinking?

And then there's another one, which I have forgotten, motivation.

There we go.

Motivation is so key.

Why are you doing the thing that you're doing?

Whatever you do, whether you eat or drink, do it for the glory of the Lord.

And what doesn't proceed from faith is sin.

So you want to make sure that in anything that you do, that you're not committing sexual morality and the explicits, that you ensure that you're not selling off purity, that you're not lusting, and anything that falls into the conscience category, you want to make sure that you're not defiling your conscience by looking at your mood of your character, the implications and effects, and the act that you're doing, and ensuring that you're doing that in faith, and that you're doing it for the glory of Christ, and not just to satisfy your own sinful desires.

There's actually a purpose to it.

And then the other thing is the accountability framework that you can apply.

And that means one or two things.

And you need to, number one, have people in place in your life that can speak in your situation, that can hold you accountable.

Are you obeying what God has commanded, or are you not?

And on a daily basis, they can hold you accountable to that, whether that be, I think, parents or guardians.

And another wave is mentors, and another wave is close and trusted friends, are three waves of accountability that should be in place when addressing this topic.

Do you have anything to say about that?

This idea of the conscience framework, the accountability framework, and how that can help us decide what goes against my conscience and what doesn't, in the things that are conscience issues and fall out of the parameters of the prescriptive and descriptive commands of sexual immorality.

Do you have anything to say about that?

I think, just to put it on the look, I think just being very prayerful about what you're doing, be very intentionally praying about what you're doing.

And I think that if you open your heart to correction and conviction, and if you ask for it, then you will get it.

So you just need to be open to it, and then also listen to it.

And sometimes conviction, not sometimes like pretty much all the time, it's a really not nice feeling.

But understanding that conviction brings us closer to the father, it makes us more in his likeness.

Conviction is a good thing.

And if you're feeling convicted about something that you and your boyfriend or your girlfriend are doing, then that's not a bad thing.

And your relationship will become more pure, it'll become more holy.

And yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So that is it for this podcast.

To summarize, now, we may have to say goodbye to the people watching.

And if you want to catch the rest or the last summary of what we've talked about, then go and listen to the audio version.

Or maybe we'll get the end of it.

I don't know.

But yeah, to summarize, we've talked about, do relationships need boundaries?

And it is a resounding yes.

In every possible aspect, spiritual boundaries and physical boundaries.

And physical is the one that we have focused on.

You do need to apply physical boundaries.

Why?

Because in any given topic, you need to go to the Bible.

The word of God, the word that is Jesus, Jesus showcases the trustworthiness and reliability of the Bible.

Jesus is the cornerstone of everything that we believe.

And so we have to go to the word, and we have to say, what does it say on this topic?

And prescriptively, it talks about this idea of sexual immorality.

And sexual immorality is anything that is going to devalue purity.

It is anything that is going to basically throw away purity in your life.

Any physical intimacy that God has declared unclean, that takes place outside the covenant in marriage, this is sexual immorality.

And a key thing is, is it causing me to lust?

Anything that will cause you to lust is you and sexual immorality, is you, as Jesus said, committing adultery.

And we have descriptive cases of that in the Bible, of those who committed sexual immorality and how it did not go well for them.

And then we basically grilled, we grilled Tierna.

Do you want to summarize the questions that we asked you?

Sure, if I can remember what I talked about.

Yeah, so first of all, why we need boundaries.

Just that sex is very powerful.

So it has to be protected.

The reason you are protecting it is because the person that you're in a relationship with, they are a daughter or a son of the king.

And yeah, if used in the wrong context, sex can be very dangerous.

And there can be a lot of sexual hurt and sexual shame that comes with that.

So yeah, boundaries are about protection.

They're about preventing us from stepping in to something that's out of line with God's will for us and God's character.

And yeah, and how our bodies aren't our own.

That's very, very important.

We are.

Yeah.

Lost my sentence.

I can, I can completely agree.

Our bodies are not our own because they were bought with a high price.

They're glorified.

So our lives should literally be just a living sacrifice for Christ, as the Bible says, in every thought, every desire, every motive, every action, our bodies are sacrificed for Christ.

And that includes in your relationships.

Thank you so much.

Spot on.

You're welcome.

Yeah.

Then how do I communicate my boundaries with my partner?

How often, I would say very often have very regular check-ins, have boundary conversations early so that you're again setting up that pattern of honesty.

And yeah, that pattern of trust between each other.

And purity is a heart posture question mark.

And yeah, so again, like reiterating what Luke said, it's not about the like do's and don'ts of like what you do in turn two.

It's about why you're doing it, your heart posture behind it.

And yeah, being open to correction, being open to conviction, having accountability, et cetera, et cetera.

And then shame.

I think a lot of people, myself included, have definitely experienced sexual shame.

And that's something that whenever you give over to the father, he will forgive you for that.

So open yourself up to that.

As well, I was meant to like put this in to some of my words, but I didn't.

So I'm just going to put it in as one of my little bit of points.

The poor people in YouTube have lost all of this, but we gave them a disclaimer.

Yes, keep going.

Yeah, so our relationship is so much more than physical aspects.

Your relationship isn't just about how much you kiss or how much you hold hands or how much you hug.

Like, yeah, it's a relationship coming together with someone and running the race together.

That is why, that's why we're here.

That's why we're in a relationship.

It's to run the race together.

It's to powerfully encourage one another.

It's to spur each other on with Jesus as a focus always.

Jesus has to remain the priority and the centerpiece of your relationship.

Then, one last thing.

So something that I've said to a few of my friends and stuff is the phrase, peace over passion.

So your relationship shouldn't be driven by passion, all these ups and all these downs and everything.

Things do like fiery and passionate and everything.

But your relationship should be driven by peace.

And that's peace that isn't of this world, but peace from the Father.

So, yeah.

Yeah, totally, totally.

And then we finished off by, again, look, Tierna, okay, what about the specific sentence?

Can I hold hands?

Can I kiss?

Can I hug?

Can I do these things?

And the answer is no and yes.

Yeah, so they're giving you really.

Yeah.

So if it falls into the prescriptive and the descriptive category, if it's going to devalue purity, if it's gonna sell purity, if it's going to fall into a prohibition that God has given with reference to sexual morality, if God has said that you cannot do this as it is sexual morality, if it is gonna fall in the category of lust, if it doesn't proceed from faith, if it is not for the glory of Christ, if there is not appropriate safeguards in place, then that's a no.

Yeah.

If it's going to defile your conscience and leave you feeling impure before the throne room of God, that's a no as well.

That's a no as well.

And so the things that you do do, you have to communicate that those boundaries mutually have to be accepted by both parties.

And for the men, that they take initiative and that they lead in this area and that they don't be cards and that they certainly don't be a stumbling block to the ladies.

Rather they say, here's where we're at, here's what we believe, here's why we believe it, and let's stick to that.

It's so important, yeah.

And again, if you want to take anything in question, okay, holding hands, okay, hugging, okay, kissing.

And whenever I talk about kissing, the nature of the kiss matters, okay?

Whenever we talk about the nature of the kiss, again, is that kiss causing you to lust?

Is that a kiss of escalation?

Or is it a kiss of stopping?

Yeah, the environment that you're in.

Exactly, yes.

Definitely can lead to...

Yes, it all matters.

So you put yourself in a position where you're going to have to...

The bomb, don't get close to the bomb.

Don't do it, get away from the bomb.

So in my relationships, I have communicated and led and taken initiative and said, okay, here's what I believe in why, here's the prescriptive and the descriptive, and here's what I would place in the conscience category, where I see my conscience on defiled, and what about you?

Where does your conscience land?

And we want to get to a place where both of our consciences are on defiled in the things that we do.

And if any one person feels defiled, you just need to stop, because you want to ensure that you are not.

Paul talks about any conscience, any weak conscience, then we lay in the side of the weak conscience.

We don't want to be a stumbling block to our weaker brother and our weaker sister.

And whenever I have kissed in my relationships, the nature of the kiss...

Yeah, yeah, I went there.

The nature of the kiss matters.

So at no given point was there, was there lust?

At no given point was there a kiss of escalation?

Okay, this is going to go somewhere.

At every point, the kiss could stop.

And at every point, the kiss was there to glorify God.

We had a heart posture of like anything, whenever we eat, whenever we drink, whenever we do what we do.

This is like for the glory of Christ, and it helps strengthen and build our relationship, whilst ensures that we are not in prescriptive sin, and also ensures that we are not defiling our conscience.

And you want to make sure that you communicate that.

And we're not giving everyone a license to just go and start doing whatever they want.

Anything in pretend that this is a love.

I will not emphasize enough, a kiss of escalation is a no, a kiss of stopping, okay?

What does that look like?

Again, that's a conscience issue.

And I think it's so important to be able to, like in the moment, say to like your boyfriend or your girlfriend, we need to stop, like get away, separate planets.

And you really should be able to do that.

Like if you're falling prey to kissing for, because I really feel like that's about it.

Because you mean handholding.

Yes, that doesn't fall in the prescriptive command for me.

It's a conscience issue.

But if it defiles your conscience, don't do it.

And whenever it comes to hugging, same thing.

If it defiles your conscience, don't do it.

It doesn't defile mine.

And whenever it comes to kissing, I feel like that's the last thing that we can go to.

Anything after that, I would find that falling into the prescriptive.

That which God has prohibited, that which it falls into the category of sexual morality, that which sells, and that which is just going to defile your conscience, no matter what safeguards you introduce.

So whenever it comes to kissing, ensure that the nature of the kiss, like you don't just use it as a license to be like, they said I could kiss.

Because that's not what we're saying.

We're saying that your conscience could allow that, we think.

But the type of kiss that your conscience could allow is one that, although awkward, you'd be happy enough for your parents to see.

Yeah, that's a good sign.

I'm not saying you mean like...

Kiss is one of the questions.

I don't think at any point would I ever want to do that no matter what it is.

But it is just to say it's a good rule.

And you want to make sure that you're not just falling captive to, well, we keep kissing, it keeps escalating, it keeps bypassing the boundaries, it keeps defiling my conscience.

Don't do it.

Yeah.

Don't do it.

Like what your mind's thinking about whenever you're kissing that person.

Yeah, well, if it's lost, then that falls into the prescriptive command.

So the question is, well, you can hardly kiss someone without lusting.

Well, if you can't, then that's it.

It's in the prescriptive category.

Yeah.

Like if you can hold hands, if you can hug, and if you can kiss, and the nature of the kiss is one of stopping and not of escalation, then if your conscious allows it, then you can do those things, because I don't think the Bible speaks prescriptively to that.

But if your conscious can't do that, don't do it.

Yeah.

And there's time for that in marriage.

And sex is so beautiful and can only be truly enjoyed and truly experienced within the covenant of marriage.

So if you can't kiss and stuff now, then wait until marriage, and then in marriage, that will be so beautiful.

And you'll know that you're doing that in a way that glorifies the Lord.

Yeah.

And always remember that this is a conversation.

That's the whole point of Wildfire.

It is youth for the youth done by the youth.

That's the whole point of the podcast.

We're not theologians.

We're not scholars.

We're not trying to say that we're going to need the best theological content.

What we are saying is that all of us who are followers of Jesus need to be obedient to the word of Christ.

All of us need to be searching the scriptures.

All of us need, in order to think, have to speak as we are doing.

And we have to stimulate conversation.

Like, I'd rather have said something wrong and someone come up and correct me to get me on the right path than say nothing and just always believe the wrong thing.

And so, yeah, engage in these topics and be obedient to the word of Christ.

And get in the word.

Like, if you've heard something and you're not sure, if you agree with it, like, that's totally okay.

That's fine.

Get into the word.

And, you know, that's where the authority is from.

That's the best place where you can get any wisdom and advice from.

So go to the word and pray about it.

Yeah.

And you know what?

You know what?

On Monday, I'm going to release a blog.

That can be paired with this.

And it's going to talk about the conscience framework and the accountability framework.

Because the conscience framework, I listed a few points, but there is much more.

And then you can apply that.

And that was just prescriptive and descriptive.

But what about the conscience area?

That really just goes up to kissing and a certain nature of kissing.

That's about it.

That's all it speaks to in this specific category.

I don't think there's anything else.

I wouldn't leave room for anything else other than that.

Inappropriate touching, anything like that.

I would find that devalued, like just selling purity again, engaging in sexual violence.

So I will release that, and then you can pair that and have that.

So what does my conscience say about this?

What is the accountability framework, and how can we have healthier and biblical relationships?

Brilliant.

I want you to end the podcast here now.

Okay.

God bless.

Go pray, go keep running.

Yeah.

Bye.